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What song(s) went through your head as you received notice of your offer?

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Hi all. Simple and sweet. New York New York? Mozart's Laudate Dominum?

What songs went through your head as you received the good news? I remember Frank Sinatra's "Bewitched" came to my mind as I hung up the phone and smiled.

Let's hear yours..

Torero

Career Services: 
<p class="h4 m-t-none">WSO Success Stories Forum Resources</p><ul class="career-resources list list-unstyled text-left"><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/investment-banking-interview-questions-a-comprehensive-guide">IB Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/private-equity-interview-questions-a-complete-guide">Private Equity Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/hedge-fund-interview-questions">HF Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/consulting-case-interviews">Consulting Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/financial-modeling-training">Financial Modeling Templates</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-finance-resume-review">Professional Resume Review</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wall-street-mentors-finance-mock-interviews">Career Coach for Wall Street</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-company-database">Salary Data by Company</a></li></ul>

Where to buy Gold with Bonus $?

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I just got a huge bonus for 2017

Banking leaves me no time for a normal relationship with a women

Why not go for Gold Diggers?

1 lb of gold = a lot?

Not really, its about $20k (small fraction of my bonus)

Where/How do i get my Gold?

  1. I can get 484 1-gram gold coins at $50 each (1lb of gold)...
    Pay a girl 1-gram gold coin (to sleep with me) multiplied by her hotness on the 1-10 scale
  2. I can get 16 1-oz gold coins for $1,300 each (1lb of gold)...
    Pay a girl 1-oz gold coin for a weekend "girlfriend experience" multiplied by hotness on the 1-10 scale divided by 10

Where is a trusted place to get gold for my plan and where do i find the gold-diggers?

Career Services: 
<p class="h4 m-t-none">WSO Success Stories Forum Resources</p><ul class="career-resources list list-unstyled text-left"><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/investment-banking-interview-questions-a-comprehensive-guide">IB Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/private-equity-interview-questions-a-complete-guide">Private Equity Interview Answers</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/hedge-fund-interview-questions">Interview at a HF</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/consulting-case-interviews">Consulting Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/financial-modeling-training">Financial Modeling Templates</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-finance-resume-review">Finance Resume Reviewers</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wall-street-mentors-finance-mock-interviews">Mentor for Finance Careers</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-company-database">Company Research</a></li></ul>

From

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It was like yesterday when I received offer from an equity long/short fund in HK and achieving my ambition I have been pursuing over the past 5 years. As a long-time WSO user, I have read numerous stories which motivate me all the way. So I think it is time for me to share my story...

Background: building foundation and interest from reading and trading
I came from a local family in Hong Kong. Back in my high school days, I am not bad at my academics, but am also hardly recognized as a straight-A student. I have no idea what an investment bank nor hedge fund is. Yet since the day I picked up a book about monetary policy and macro economic indicators, I start to feel obsessed with economics, and later investment. I started my trading account, and used my limited knowledge to try to identify investment opportunities by monetary policy analysis and value-investment (well...at least I thought I am doing it right back then). By the time I am graduated, I still perceive this as my interests, but not career option...My public examination result is far from satisfaction, but luckily I still manage to get into a target local school.

1st 2 years in college : from GPA <2.0 to a boutique IB porter
My first year almost killed my career: I become obsessed with student society work in college. I dedicated so much that my GPA in one semester dropped below 2.0. Don't get me wrong, I actually find this one of the most rewarding experience I have ever had throughout my college. I get the chance to achieve many breakthroughs that I cannot get from elsewhere. Yet until year 2 I have no idea what I want to do, and thus have no motivation to have good time management and self-discipline to achieve big.

Actually since year 1 I have already come across with investment banking and hedge funds. However, since year 1, there are lots of bright students, obviously understanding how intense the competition was to break into investment banking, working so hard and preparing themselves to get into investment banking, such as asking seniors for referrals, getting internship in relevant firms (such as Big 4, boutique IB), and preparing for interviews. With my mediocre academic results, I have never attempted to get into investment banking.

It was a 3-year college curriculum for me back then, so in my year-2 spring semester, with my blank resume, I have to start thinking about what I should be doing after graduation. It was that moment when I feel like I should reluctantly accept the fact that it was already good enough for a student like me being hired right after graduation by a small company, I receive a piece of advise from my relatives that "it is the best to find a job which fits your interest". When I look at my book shelf full of investment-related books, I feel like I should at least give it a try, and if I failed, I should still be better than sitting there and doing nothing right? Yet, how can I even get an interview from an investment bank or a hedge fund with my blank resume?

I decided to go bold: cold-emailing and cold-calling. It is actually less common back then in Hong Kong comparing to US or Europe for students to do cold-emailing and cold-calling. Thanks to WSO, I received many good advice to prepare for how to do cold-emailing or cold-calling. I have sent over 300 emails during the semesters to look for summer internship. However, obviously I was too late. It was March that I started to do such things, and most summer internship positions have already been filled. It was in late May when I suddenly received a call, it was a boutique investment bank I applied online before for a "summer internship" position. I was quickly accepted after 1 round of interview by a HR, and later I found out why the procedure goes so quick...they are actually looking for a porter, not really a summer intern with return offer opportunity, since they are moving their office to the new location across the street. And me, as an summer intern, has spent a sweaty summer packing all the documents and stuff in the office...

Year-3-and-4...and year-5 in college: from a porter, to hedge fund intern, and finally, a bulge bracket intern
**Yet after going back to school, I didn't give up. I know at least I have an investment bank on my resume now. I started to receive a few interviews for semester internship. One in particular caught my interest: It was a USD1bn equity long/short hedge fund. This is when I realize my readings over the years finally paid off. I have gone through all 4 rounds of interviews with my knowledge in monetary policy, in particular those of Asian economies, and stocks. When I finally receive an offer, and was asked to sign the contract in their office, I realize a semester internship in a hedge fund is not enough for me to get an investment banking or hedge fund job. So I decide to make another big decision: I offer to work for free, full-time, for half year in the fund by taking half-year off from school, and they accepted.

It was a fruitful year in the hedge fund. According to my managers before my internship ends, it is actually a wise decision for me to take a placement comparing to a semester internship, because it is also of their interest to allocate more resources to train me in all aspects, instead of giving me ad-hoc assignments, which I believe many of you might have experienced during an summer internship.

There is one thing that I have never stopped doing, cold-emailing. By cold-emailing I have actually landed an equity research internship in an investment bank right after my hedge fund internship. But by the time I have declined other interviews and ready to accept the offer, my offer was suddenly withdrawn, because "someone with special relationship" has taken my seat. I was shocked, but quickly accepted this as the reality of the industry (interestingly, during the same year, there are series of investigations and allegations against US-based IB granting special internship/job offer to candidates with "special relationship", in particular in Asia (/Hong Kong)). Fortunately my boss in the hedge fund was satisfied with my work, and was willing to offer me another 3 months to stay until I found another internship.

After 9 months of placement, I have returned to school to finish my last 2 semesters. When I start to hunt for full-time job, another opportunity popped up: an interview for an internship position for a bulge bracket bank. Perceiving it more like a office visit (of course, i did prepare seriously for that), it turns out I am so blessed to pass all 5 rounds of interviews and successfully landed an offer. This is when my reading works again: I talked about why I think Abenomics (Japan) is more likely to fail given how self-contradicting the policies were, I talked about why Indian economy is structurally a failure over the past decade, I explained why I think China will not have a hard landing, but instead a debt restructuring which could give rise to another infrastructure boom, etc. I talked about my stock pitch for an hour. All thanks to the reading and preparation I have done, and of course, my luck.

After finishing another fruitful internship and finishing my last semester in college, I have decided not to return to the bank, and went to a smaller but reputable research platform by referral from a network I know from cold-emailing, and recently landed in a sizable hedge fund. My efforts paid off.

What I think I have done which you can also try
1. Don't ask for tips, ask about how solid you are
There are always juniors asking me about "tips" during an interview, but indeed, my biggest "tips" is to seriously prepare for your technical knowledge, and it is fine to be over-prepared. These are the things that can knock you out from the next round once you get the answer wrong, but not the personality questions like "how do you foresee yourself in 5 years".

2. Your interviewer is looking for a colleague to work with, not a superhero
When I was doing mock interview for students, I sometimes realize how tense the students are, and always giving the same answers to the personality questions. Interviewer is looking for a colleague to work with, and thus it is sometimes a good idea to be more genuine and show your true self, such as smiling more, making proper jokes, asking interviewer personal (but of course, proper and not awkward) questions and further discuss on that (within a proper time horizon). Make sure that you show that you can also be a person he can hang out with after work. This helps winning impression as well. On the contrary, don't be over-confident, don't speak like you know everything. Your interviewers are always smarter than you. Stay humble in front of them.

3. Find a career buddy
1+1 >2. A good career buddy, or peer group, can always not only share useful resources (network, preparation materials, etc) among each other, but also motivate each other when one of you get an internship or interviews.

4. Setting long-term career goal, not just looking for a full-time job
Setting long-term goal and vision the process you need helps efficiently shape your career planning, such as resources/knowledge you need in the future, preparation for alternative career pathway, etc. For example, if you ultimately aim for hedge fund, a sell-side research experience is a plus, and therefore sell-side research is the first job you should target, not straightly targeting hedge fund. If you target to be a trader, you can foresee how trading will looking in say 10-year time, and therefore programming will be what you need. If you target to work in sell-side research, you can vision the impact from MiFID II, and decide whether the risk-reward is still worth for yourself.

5. Read, Read, Read
This is more of my personal advice, but reading did help me a lot. Good books give you edge when answering technical questions and make yourself unique. I also suggest putting your favorite reading list onto your resume to create one more topic between yourself and the interviewers. This works very well for me, and at least 3 times the interviewers actually have the same favorite book as me

6. Networking is not for internship, genuinely treasure the relationship you built for your entire life
After sending over 700+ emails, I actually did not get any internships from these. But I did receive many good advice, both work and life, which shape me to become who I am right now. Those you connect by cold-emailing usually have met someone else before. Therefore they know your intention. Build a good impression, and they will offer your help even after graduation. I still kept frequent contacts with at least 10 networks I built during college time.

7. Think about the downside, think about plan B
I met many people so determined to break into investment banking for various reasons. Yet one common thing I found is that they seldom talked about the downside they could possibly face. Many people quit investment banking 2-3 years after landing the so-called dream job because of not being able to sustain physically and mentally due to the high intensity of the job and the long working hours. To make things worse they could be sacrificing their family, spouse, friends, health, or time for learning, building new habits, gym, travel, etc until they realize what kind of life they want to be in. Sadly this is usually only realized by people working in the industry, while others will only see the bright side. Find people and talk, and be honest to your self. Think about plan B if investment banking is not your ultimate dream job.

8. Even if you failed to get what you want, you have already taken steps others didn't, and have grown to a better person
Recalling my journey, the one thought that keeps popping up in my mind is "fairly speaking it might be too tough for me to get into investment banking with a CV like mine". Actually til now, I agree with this, but what kept motivating me is the belief that even if I failed, I should have grown better. It is the process that matters, and when you keep pursuing excellence, something surprisingly rewarding will follow.
**
9. Don't be afraid to take gap year**
The best decision I have made is to take gap years to enrich my resume. It is not only because of the extra time and names you can have on your resume, but also about the network you can get from the colleague, graduation, the potential return offers and making your next employees being convinced that you are really learning something from your previous experiences. Yes, it feel weird to defer a year and not being able to graduate with your best friends, but the reward is huge.

There are too many to share, but let's stop here first. I am happy to answer any question and share more stories.

Non-target --> FT Off-Cycle IBD Analyst

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banking career

So I have been around here for about a year and half now, and have to say thank you to the community. Really learned a lot and got my foot in door based on the advice on these forums.

The Non-Target School

Now for my story, I attended a large (20,000+ students) non-target school. We were in proximity to a banking center but for the most part had no recruiting for any positions related to IBD. To be truthful, I didn't even know what IBD was until about 2 years ago. Met a kid in a bar, told me about the career path and sounded like something I would like.

Rough Start

Nonetheless, I messed up horribly throughout college due to my mother passing away the summer before my Freshman year. This led to non-stop drinking throughout my career. First day I came to campus, decided I wanted to pledge and that was the best/worst decision I made. Love the people the friends and the camaraderie, but it did heavily influence my substance abuse. I finished up my freshman year and worked at a small accounting firm in the college town, just taking summer classes and bullshitting around.

...That Just Got Worse

During this time I dated a girl lets call her L, who severely hemorrhaged my ability to make logical decisions. She would often use my emotional attachment to her, which came from my lack of family support, to her advantage. This culminated in us getting messed up every night. Ended up breaking up with her because I found out she cheated on me which left me devastated but not done.

Started my sophomore year, and at this point my father was in the process of getting remarried, whilst my sister was busy getting a masters degree at an ivy-league institution. I had been left a large sum of money which I used to pay for school/support a drinking and drug habit. This began to dwindle quickly as I overspent without any regard to how difficult it is to actually earn money.

Therefore based on my social circle, I decided to sell various exotic substances we will call them to support my habit and get me through school. I will let you be creative enough to think of which ones. While I did make a a lot of money doing so, I also used and abused. Began dating a new girl during this time that enjoyed similar habits as I did at the time. This really led to us just attending a bunch of music festivals and having sex as a reason to miss class. I was lucky that school was fairly easy still and my grades never really slipped.

I was on scholarship as well so I never wanted to lose it. This made me always keep my grades in check think I never got below a 3.5 for the most part.

The Bottom

Nevertheless, the lifestyle was unhealthy and it began to unravel towards the end of my sophomore year. I ended up failing my first class and had to retake it during the summer. I did so, but did the stupidest thing I ever could have and decided to try and cheat instead of study. I ended up getting caught and this led to me being dismissed from school for 1 year. I was lost distraught I did not know what to do. I thought my life was over, thinking as a 20 year old that I will never be successful. I ended up losing the girlfriend who I adored, friends abandoned me and well all of my life went to shit per se.

3 Random Jobs & Getting Back Up

During this year is when everything changed in my life. I picked up 3 random jobs from bar tending, to hosting, and even picked and packed boxes at warehouse. All of the most meaningless and repetitive tasks known to man. It did indeed build a respect now for the average working American. It really in essence got my ego in check which was my biggest dilemma.

I quit selling/drinking so much and finally got the help I needed during this time as well. My family began to give me the support I needed which quickly healed a lot of old wounds. Also, remember how I had mentioned earlier I met a friend who was very interested in IBD? He was one of the few people to stick by me as he "saw potential" in me. Funny enough he was right in the end. I worked my ass off this entire year and saved up enough to put myself back into school.

People Came Back

Many people began to return to my life during this time as well who had abandoned me earlier. Began to realize the whole actions speak louder than words mantra really does hold true. I spent the summer which puts me at the beginning of my junior year academic wise but I should be a senior at this point. I buckled down when I returned to school and never got anything less than a 4.0 the rest of the way. I had no idea how to get into IBD and began reading these very forums to figure out what the hell I needed to do.

Networking and Tools to Make It

I started networking very late and didn't get an analyst role in the summer, but did find a BO/MO role at a BB bank. I loved every minute of that internship, and was hooked on working in banking.

As a competitive person though, I wanted to premier role and that led me to really spend the last year making sure I networked in. During the summer at my BB internship, we had the xxxx.xxx@xxxx.com email handle. Got a lot of response to this handle as compared with an @gmail.com. Probably was not supposed to do this, but as an intern they didn't look after us very much.

I used this along with Linkedin to seek out any alumni I could speak with. I ended up getting a pretty high response rate because I emailed them constantly and professionally. There are probably 100-150 alumni i found and spoke with probably 70 of them.

I Sent Over 400 Emails

Being a non-target the people who were involved really enjoyed speaking with students sharing a similar interest. It led me to a PE shop position I was able to take on for my fall semester as well as numerous interviews with MM/BB banks. I think I sent probably 400+email, 200+phone calls, self-financed a trip to Chicago, NYC and Houston. These along with being presentable and having a good story have taken me the farthest.

Then I Bombed My Interviews...At first.

After doing all my networking, I began interviewing and sucked the first 2 or 3 times. I mean I was the worst candidate in the group because I was nervous. Eventually, I found my balls and began to understand the process and what qualities they were interested in. Also, working at a PE shop, I began to really understand the technical aspects that people dread. Honestly, besides one particular boutique/MM shop I never got really ridiculous technical.

The investment banking interview course from WSO was fantastic and the models were easy to follow. After perfecting my story, I still kept ending up short handed. I was pretty discouraged until I had a VP I had spoken with email me asking if I was still looking for a position. Fortunately I was, crazy enough an analyst from a different group at the same bank emailed me asking if I wanted to interview for an analyst role for them as well.

Super Days!

I ended up getting past the gate keepers and did a double super-day at the office going from 1 group to the next. This time, I was prepared and felt awesome about everything I had done. I probably got 3 blocks from the office until that beautiful area code popped up, received my first FT offer for an off-cycle hire as a BBIBD analyst.

After saying thank you, and barely getting back to my hotel, the second group called and extended an offer as well. This is right around the holiday time so you have to imagine I'm ear to ear grinning after all I had done to get there.

It Kept Getting Better...

But it kept getting better, a position I had interview for that I thought I had not gotten also made me an offer the same day. So there I was tired from endless interviews with 3 offers from BB/MMIBD groups. I was finally, in my experience happy as everything I knew I could do was finally going in my favor.

The countless risks I took were paying off. I now start in a couple weeks with a group I had been hoping to join up with from the beginning as a FT analyst. Felt that there are not enough true to the heart stories sometimes, but this is as honest as it comes.

2.5 Years...

I went from being kicked out of school, friendless and down on my luck to 2 and half years later taking a plane home to see my family with 3 IBD offer letters. Although, I am excited/nervous to start my new career, just felt I my story my inspire people who may feel down on their luck as well. I thought at 20 years old my life was over, now I realize it's just beginning. Keep chipping away my fellow monkeys opportunity awaits those who work for it.

If anyone wants any clarifications, feel free to post a response, not going to get very personal but will clarify any tactics I used and tid-bits I picked up if anyone is curious.

Thanks for the support everyone, really appreciate it. Look forward to an opportunity to give back in the future.

Only allow Certified Users to respond: 

30 year-old breaking in

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I am still not sure if this will add any value or if anyone will find this useful, but I've seen a couple of "Too old to break into IB?" topics lately and I thought I'd share my journey with you. The advice and stories I've read on this forum have helped me maintain my sanity after more rejections than I wish to remember.

The following story is not a story of someone from a troubled background, poor family or anything that would excuse my failures. I simply made poor choices along the way, for which I had to pay the price. My story begins with me just having graduated from high school and it's a long and complicated one, so bear with me or skip ahead to the last few paragraphs.

18 years old

University is free back home, and since my high school grades were decent, I was good at maths and had no clue what I wanted to do next, I enrolled in a five year joint BSc and MSc programme in mathematics. Boy, was that a mistake!

After one semester I hated it and decided to take a break from uni to pursue a career as a painter and theatre designer. Wrap your head around that! I still look back and want to timetravel and bitchslap 18 year-old me.

19 - 22 years old

While I was passionate about art, I was utterly mediocre at it. Combine that with the fact that being an artist, even a talented one, doesn't pay sufficiently to make a living, reality came knocking after three years of failing to make it in my poorly chosen pursuit. I needed to do something else in my life, but I had no clue where to start. Hence, not knowing what else to do, I went back to uni to finish my degree.

22 - 25 years old

3 years passed by and I was sick of it. I simply was not interested in math. I had to push through and figure out what I would do afterwards. I had somehow managed to pass all the courses and all I had left to do was to write a dissertation to get my degree. I didn't write my dissertation. Instead, I took a second break from uni to start my own business.

25 - 27 years old

I don't know whether I had a high level of risk-tolerance or whether I was simply unaware of the risk involved, but after a series of discussions with my best friend, we decided to start our own business. I was still a student while he had just graduated. We had a decent idea and a solid network of people who would be our potential first clients, so after conducting market research and writing a business plan, we dove in. We bootstrapped the whole thing, and what followed was the two most fun and stressful years of my life.

Aggressive sales, technology and complementary skill sets enabled us to grow the company rapidly. We had 10 employees after one year, captured more than 50% of the market share, revenues were 6 figures and we maintained great margins.

This was my first contact with accounting and finance. Somewhere along the way, I started reading about finance; anything I could get my hands on. I also had money for the first time in my life. I was fulfilled and happy, until I wasn't anymore.

After two years of running the business, an external investor approached me and asked to buy my shares at an attractive price. I knew that my partner did not want any outsiders in the company, so being a good friend and valuing my friendship with the guy, I offered him to buy me out at the same price. No competition, no bullshit. He agreed and to this day we still have a great relationship.

27 - 28 years old

The next natural step for me was to write my damn dissertation and finally get the godforsaken maths degree. However, obligations came knocking: the military. You see, military service is mandatory in my country for a year. While completing my military service, I also managed to finish my dissertation and got the degree. Mid-summer of 2014, I was honorably discharged, had my degree and still had no clue what I would do next.

28-29 years old

I thought maybe I should do something related to consulting or finance. At least, those were careers that had piqued my interest in the past. Or perhaps, I would do a MSc degree somewhere in western Europe. I started researching the world of finance. Eventually, WSO was one of the sites I came across. I read and read; forums, textbooks, financial modelling guides, guides about how to tailor your CV and cover letter for investment banking positions. If you haven't checked out the IB Interview Prep Course, you definitely should.

I became obsessed. I liked financial modelling, I liked the work that I thought analysts do, so I started applying to positions in London: Off-cycle internships and graduate schemes. I was technically after all, a recent graduate and I also had a unique background. I thought that maybe "I might actually stand a chance" since banks boast on their websites how they welcome diversity and people from various backgrounds, I thought naively.

Right. Out of 100 applications in 4 months, I was invited to only one phone interview. One. And they rejected me of course.

I was 1,500 miles away from London, with no opportunity to network, and a degree from an unknown - to U.K. recruiters - university, which had taken me 10 years to complete. None of my friends or acquaintances even knew what investment banking was; my only source of knowledge and advice was the internet.

And the internet unanimously concluded that I would need some relevant experience under my belt and an MSc degree from the UK if I wanted to stand a chance in recruiting.

So I did what came naturally to me. I went to the offices of a regional bank (multiple times) and offered to work for free in their investment banking division. After two weeks, they interviewed me and I broke in. They didn't have an internship programme, but I guess they liked my persistence or it was pure luck.

December 1st 2014 was my first day at work. There was no training provided and I was initially given menial tasks. Fast forward a few months, I built solid relationships with the team and was given increasingly more responsibility. I had a very close relationship with an MD. He essentially made me his analyst and even tried to get the bank to pay me something, though he didn't succeed. However, I was slowly building my skill set, forming relationships with people in the industry and getting staffed on deals.

Subsequently, the MD encouraged me to apply to an MSc programme in London, which I did and to which I was accepted.

29-30 years old

In the summer of 2015, the bank offered me an analyst position. Bear in mind that although the pay did not compare with pay in western Europe, the economic and political situation in my country was extremely unstable. A "stable" job in an environment like that would have been a blessing to most people. I rejected the offer with the goal to complete an MSc in London and then pursue a career in the city. The people close to me thought I had lost it (to be fair, it wasn't the first time the thought had crossed their mind).

Some insight on how I chose the uni and the MSc programme

Let me make a distinction first. It's not necessarily true that a uni's graduate programme will place as well in IBD as the same uni's undergrad programme. I know because I checked. I checked hundreds of LinkedIn profiles to see specifically where graduate programmes were placing their students. University rankings do not matter. The only thing that matters is how well a uni places at the firms you want to work.

For EU students who don't have a BSc from a UK uni, even if you do a MSc in the UK, recruiters and HR will still prefer people who got their BSc at a UK uni. However, this shouldn't stop you from doing a MSc in the UK or apply for positions. Just be aware of how you are perceived.

I knew that Oxbridge, LSE, LBS, Imperial and Warwick were the main targets for IBD, but I also knew that they would reject me. I applied to LSE which rejected me. And then there were the semi-targets. Location and being able to network was extremely important to me so I chose to attend a uni that is in London and is below LSE, LBS and Imperial in terms of placement (you can probably guess which one).

I arrived in London and the uphill battle continued. The university in London was good, and they pride themselves on having an excellent careers office. No. The careers office, and probably most careers offices, provide excellent advice to clueless foreigners who have never written an application in their life. But if you know how to write a cover letter and a CV (get some feedback from people in the industry), a careers office will not add any value. Just check the page where they post available positions. They did organize a career fair at the beginning of the first semester and I met some people whom I still keep in touch. They also brought in some speakers from the industry, but those people rarely stayed for networking after their speech. So after going to a couple of these events, I realized that I can spend those two hours more efficiently, so I re-calibrated my approach:

a) Submit a large volume of online applications either on the company's website or on the countless jobsites that exist.

Surprisingly, applying online in the UK is not the black hole that is in the US. A well-written cover letter and CV does actually go a long way (if anyone actually reads them). Trust me on that. I have helped more classmates than you can imagine with their cover letters and CVs. The ones they sent or wanted to send before editing were horrific. Do not overestimate the competition.

b) Following-up after an application to any company, I went on LinkedIn and connected with people who worked there.

I sent them a short message, where I introduced myself, told them I had already applied to the company and asked them to have a quick conversation over coffee or over the phone. Almost 1 out of 5 agreed. Every person that was either an alumnus or came from my country agreed to meet me. All levels. From analysts to MDs. Also, most Americans agreed to meet with me. I guess they're more used to networking like that.

Another thing that I learned through this process is that at Bulge Brackets, MDs can help after your CV has passed the HR screening process; not before, at least that's what they told me. Does that mean that you shouldn't try to meet them? No! Meet everyone. Leave no stone unturned.

c) If I applied to a smaller company and no one connected with me on LinkedIn, I waited for a few days and then called them.

I asked if they received my application and told them that the position was my dream job and that I would love to work for them. I received three interviews on the spot using this method.

d) I joined a relevant society (M&A, PE, Investing, etc) at uni and took up a leadership role.

At the beginning of the year, there will be many enthusiastic classmates who will want to participate in societies. As schoolwork piles up and becomes increasingly demanding, people will give up. Out of the initial 40-50 people in a society by the end of the second month, only five will still participate actively. You want to be one of those five! Organize events and invite people as speakers from the industry. Give them at least two or three months notice. Make sure to advertise your events and bring an audience. Out of all the speakers, some will be definitely willing to talk to you about future job prospects.

I still keep in touch with all my contacts, send them an email every two months to update them on my progress and see how they're doing. I ask to meet them for a quick coffee again if they have time.
I'd encourage everyone to do that. People will let you know about positions that aren't even advertised.

That was my approach. I was rejected immediately from all the Bulge Brackets I applied to.

I applied to over 150 firms this year alone. I made it to several final rounds at banks, consulting firms, PE shops and a couple of HFs. My technicals were tight, but so were other people's and these people had better pedigrees. I was rejected by most of them.

Up until May I had nothing solid. A few more first, second and final rounds, but no offers. I had several fit interviews, case studies, modeling and powerpoint tests under my belt.

Two weeks ago, I had the third and final round with a small advisory firm. So far, I really liked the people who interviewed me and the work that the firm does. I had to present a case study which I prepared at home for the partners, sat down with them and got to know each other. Four days ago, on Monday, one of the partners called and offered me the position. I accepted. In the following days, I received two more offers. Since I prefer the first firm more than the other two, I will be starting with them in September.

Some final thoughts

- I was lucky. I persisted a lot, especially over the last couple of years. However throughout most of my journey up until now, I was also lucky. It's not just hard work.

- If you have a weird background, target smaller firms. People there are more approachable and they actually have more influence in hiring decisions.

- I did my due diligence on the firms. Researched recent deals, people who worked there and understood how their business model worked. I practiced my technicals as well as crafted an interesting story which could be presented within two minutes.

- I am extremely thankful to all the people who were willing to meet with me and give me 15 mins of their time. I have invited some of them out for lunch and will invite the rest of them soon. They all bought me a cup of coffee and shared their best advice. The least I can do to thank them is take them out for lunch.

- I mentioned that throughout this soul-crushing process of continuous rejections, some classmates asked me for help. I tried to help them as much as I could. We might even have competed for the same positions in a few cases, but it doesn't matter. What goes around, comes around.

- At the end of the day not being a complete asshole is good for the soul.

I want to thank everyone here, who without realizing it has helped me along the way.

Thank you WSO!

I hope that some of you got something out of this, or were at least entertained.

How I went from 10 rejections to one dream internship this year.

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Finance Interviews:

Goldman Sachs 1st round. No.
Altamont Capital 1st round. No.
Bracebridge Capital 1st round. No
Bridgewater Associates 1st round. No.

Consulting Interviews:

Cornerstone Research 1st round No.
Analysis Group 1st round. No.
Simon-Kucher 1st round. No.

Final Round Interviews:

Centerview Final round. No.
BlackRock Final round. No.
JP Morgan Final round. No.
Another Bulge Bracket Bank -- YES! the final interview I ever had AFTER the slew of rejections above.

Learn from rejection:

I'm not going to say what company I did get into (to remain anonymous), but I did get into a BB this year. Coming from a finance background with a high GPA at an IVY, I started getting depressed because I got dinged in so many interviews. There were so many times when I felt like my efforts were futile. THEY'RE NOT! Once you get rejected, move on to the next one. Learn from it. What did you do wrong? Was it a technical question that stumped you? Was it the fit questions? Behavioral questions?

There is always room for improvement:

PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. With your roommates, friends, and career center. Whether on the phone, skype, or in person. There is ALWAYS room for improvement. Smile during the interviews. I found that you have a much personable look when you do. Don't be afraid to talk about you what makes you unique (I won art competitions in the past, which surprised many interviewers). As for consulting, don't be stupid like me--go and PRACTICE how to answer case study questions with someone. As for finance, make sure to study up on the technical (the WSO was a god send here!). There are always the same questions (DCFs, valuations, etc.). Use the Investment Banking Interview Prep Course ...I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer.

In summary, this was the most grueling thing I did in college. I'm glad I did it because it was a great learning experience. Moral of the story: DON'T GIVE UP, NO MATTER HOW IMPOSSIBLE IT LOOKS. If this didn't convince you, then I don't know what would.

The background story is here: I'm so pathetic--I can't get past 1st round Interviews

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Questioning the popularity of IB/PE/HF/Conuslting/law etc

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Is a career on wall street truly the best way to become successful as opposed to building your business?(real question, not trolling).

For example in Peter Lynch's quora answer he writes " I like to joke with people in my industry that we kid ourselves into believing we're on the best path to success when really we are just competing to meet and partner with the founder CEOs that have already pulled it off."

Peter Thiel voices similar sentiments in Zero to One book and Warren Buffet with his quote Wall Street is the only place that people ride to in a Rolls Royce to get advice from those who take the subway.

I am a student and though I have been interested studying markets early on, I find it odd that all these PE/ HF/ IB shops are really to service someone else yet so many people rush to careers in servicing the wealthy instead of trying to become those very clients that your target bank/hf/pe/law firm serves.

It also explains why we have seen less innovation than what is really possible.

What are your thoughts on this?

Career Services: 
<p class="h4 m-t-none">WSO Success Stories Forum Resources</p><ul class="career-resources list list-unstyled text-left"><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/investment-banking-interview-questions-a-comprehensive-guide">Investment Banking Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/private-equity-interview-questions-a-complete-guide">Private Equity Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/hedge-fund-interview-questions">Hedge Fund Interviews</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/consulting-case-interviews">Case Interview Prep: Consulting</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/financial-modeling-training">Best Financial Modeling Courses</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-finance-resume-review">Professional Resume Editor</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wall-street-mentors-finance-mock-interviews">Mock Interview Tips & Coach</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-company-database">Salary Data by Company</a></li></ul>
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Are girls who are on birth control more or less attractive to you, holding all else equal?

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She's back at your place, and things start getting fiesty.
Before you know it, both of you are bare(ly wearing anything).
You reach for a rubber in your condom drawer, but she pulls your hand away.
"No it's ok babe, I'm on the pill."

In my mind, her desirability drops slightly. It makes me think she sleeps around quite often (as in, a lot)
Obviously, I don't make a huge deal out of it and keep at it (depending on the girl, I might make fun of her).
[Yes, some girls are on the pill to reduce mood swings every month.
For argument's sake, let's assume she's taking it purely for contraceptive reasons.]

For perspective, I'm a guy in my late 20s with the girls ranging from 18-22.

So I'm curious. For you guys in this situation, does your impression of her change?
Or do you not give a flying fuck.

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Non-Target, 3.0 < GPA, non-finance major, to ER

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equity research

Background: I went to a non-target, had a 2.7 GPA, and didn't study finance in college. Ended up landing a job in ER.

I apologize in advance that I have failed to contribute as much as I should to these forums. WSO was one of the main tools I used and find myself looking at boards plenty often.

My story:

Throughout college I never knew what I wanted to do. I was a curious kid who liked figuring out how things work. I liked investing and always had wall st. (specifically ER) in the back of my mind.

It wasn't until late in my collegiate career that I wanted to get into ER. In fact, with 4 weeks until graduation, I decided to decline pervious job offers to pursue a career in ER.

If anyone would like to know my entire story as to how I did it, I will post in detail my full background. For now, I will tell you the most important tips that I have for anyone to break in,

#1 - Networking and how not to do it

You've heard it a million times that you should network. In my opinion, I think the term networking is overused and has been misconstrued ever since LinkedIn came about. Most people think networking is establishing some sort of business connection (which it really is). But in my opinion, a business connection can only go so far.

I set up a "networking" meeting about 3x a week for 4 months. The people that helped me the most were the people in which I developed friendships with rather than a "connection".

Moral of the story, don't network. Develop some sort of relationship and don't be a some kid just trying to get the hook up on a job. Express genuine interest in their careers and lives. Be a genuine human being. It's pretty simple.

I knew nobody in finance. I cold called people and expressed genuine interest in not a job, but learning about their job and what suggestions they had for me.

#2 - Don't apply to jobs, you're wasting your time

I interviewed at about 6 shops (1 for IB, 5 for ER) ended up getting 2 offers (one buy side and one sell side) and made it to the final round at multiple MM shops.

One guy told me that at his old shop (MM) that they never hired a guy that they somehow didn't know. Don't just apply to a bunch of banks cause you are truly wasting your time. And no, don't go through HR.

Out of all of the places I interviewed, only two places had the job posted some where (yes that is illegal) but that is just how the game is played.

#3 - "Walk me through your resume"

On this forum, people stress technical questions and how to answer them. Stop focusing on how to walk somebody thru a DCF and get them to engage and buy into you.

This is the most important part of the interview hands down. Get your story down and practice it. Everybody has a story. Tell it. I really think the WSOIB Interview Prep Course helps you shape your story, especially the fit module, so I highly recommend you check it out.

Nobody cares if you know the technicals. You know why? Because learning how to connect the three financial statements, model, and do a DCF is easy. They want to know if you're the type of guy they can work with for 12-15 hours a day and not want to kill. It's all about the Fit. It was apparent that I didn't fit in at some shops and I was fine with that.

#4 - If you are from a non-target, embrace it

The best shop that I interviewed at really liked the fact that I wasn't from a target school. In fact, only one guy had actually heard of my school. I ended up making it to the final two and all of the interviewers really appreciated it even though they were all from targets.

I apologize in advance for the poor writing.

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From No-Name College to Buy-Side Out of Undergrad

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Hello all,

Long time lurker and first time poster.

I just wanted to share how much WSO has helped me.

4 Years ago I was a no-name at a no-name university and had nearly failed out of High-school. I decided one day to sit down and change my life (after receiving a LOUD wake-up call). So, I did what any money-hungry little freshman would do and literally googled, "what jobs make the most money?" My naiver self found that there were surgeons and hedge fund managers pulling in the dough, and I was not about to go to med school.

I ended up turning my life around: losing 20 lbs, getting a girlfriend, and eventually receiving a 4.0 after my first year. I applied to better schools near me (as a family member was sick and I needed to be near her). I was accepted into a semi-target in Texas.

After partying my way through Sophomore year I decided it was time to refocus. I made another 4.0 the first semester my junior year and decided after a drunken night that Id like to enter proprietary trading. So, I used WSO's interview guide and prop shop list and applied to over 80 proprietary firms all over the United States.

Only one of them accepted me and I spent my junior summer there.

After coming into my senior year I decided I did not want to do prop trading. This was a major problem as I did not have much deal exposure, or really any experience at all. I also knew I did not want to do investment banking (as many of my friends had done it and I did not think Id like it). So I went back to my roots. I applied to hedge funds.

Using one of the forums on this sight I contacted as many hedge funds as I could: Cold-emailing, Cold-Calling, and speaking to numerous people. I even sent in a physical resume to over 100 different firms. I got about 10 responses. Only 3 interviews.

I eventually found out that one of the 3 funds that I thought was a hedge fund was a Family Office (~1 Bil AUM) that was invested fully in Private Equity. I really like their work, and aced all 6 rounds of interviews. They eventually extended an offer to me that I accepted. I will be working as a private equity associate.

Without WSO none of this would have been possible and I am very happy to say that I am finally on the path that I was meant to be on.

I am sure I will get grilled for this post, but if there are any questions I can answer please ask, and I will get to them right away.

Career Services: 
<p class="h4 m-t-none">WSO Success Stories Forum Resources</p><ul class="career-resources list list-unstyled text-left"><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/investment-banking-interview-questions-a-comprehensive-guide">IB Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/private-equity-interview-questions-a-complete-guide">Private Equity Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/hedge-fund-interview-questions">HF Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/consulting-case-interviews">Consulting Interview Questions</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/financial-modeling-training">Excel and Financial Modeling </a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-finance-resume-review">Finance Resume Reviewers</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wall-street-mentors-finance-mock-interviews">Mock Interviews - Finance Jobs</a></li><li><a href="https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/wso-company-database">Company Research</a></li></ul>
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If You Want to Learn How to Get a Job on the Street, Read my Story

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Whatsup Monkeys,

I thought it would be important for all college students to read my story and understand that ITS NOT IMPOSSIBLE to get a job on the street coming from a Non-target school. I'm sorry if this post is long, I just have first-hand experience going through recruiting and I know how stressful and debilitating it can be at times. This is my story:

Summer before junior year

So lets back this up a little bit. Came from an average public high school, had a sh!tty GPA and okay SAT scores. Ended up at a private non-target college, recruited to play D1 Football. Really had a tough time balancing the whole student-athlete thing for the first year or two, and had nothing to call home about GPA wise. Decided to double major in Finance and Economics. The summer going into my junior year I had applied at a few local wealth management shops near my town. Nothing panned out for me the way I wanted it to so I took a job at a very small (8 employees) accounting firm, really just doing administrative work. I had met with the two partners and told them my background and what I was interested in which was equity research and trading. They gave me a few projects regarding company valuation, and I pretty much taught myself how to do a three statement valuation model. All in all, it was an okay experience but nothing that I was really interested in.

Junior year - determined to land a big-time internship

From there, junior year of college I really began to hit the books hard and raised my GPA significantly. I became really interested in the markets and would spend hours doing just my own research on one of the schools Bloomberg Terminals. I was determined to land a big-time internship for the summer going into Senior year as I knew the chances of getting a FT offer was a lot higher with an internship experience within that company. I sent out applications to all of the Bulge Bracket Banks, and all of the big time Asset Managers. I received 2 first round interviews for two separate positions at Blackrock and a first round interview for IBD at JPM.

Hopes were crushed

To make a long story short, I did not receive a second round interview at JPM, but for Blackrock, I made it to the third round Superday for both positions. I was siked! I took part in both Superdays (2 1/2 hours each) and left that office in NYC feeling like a million bucks because I knew I had great chances of landing one of the internships. Month, after Month, after Month, after Month goes by and finally 5 months after my interview the HR rep at BlackRock calls me and tells me that I didn't get either position. Crushed was an understatement. I thought my career aspirations were completely over. I knew that my odds of applying to FT jobs without internal internship experience would crush my chances. So I ended up sending out around 60 applications that night and landed an internship at an insurance/Mutual fund shop in NYC.

Networking Hustle

I was well aware that this place did not make any full time offers to their interns, so I had made the decision to make the most out of this internship experience and make as many connections as I possibly could. For the course of 10 weeks, there was not a week where I didn't have at least 4 coffee networking sessions or lunches with people all throughout Manhattan. I was on WSO every single day reading as many posts as I could to find a single FT opening for any company. I was determined to land a Full-time job on the street. Then, I created an excel spreadsheet and made a list of 400+ banks, asset managers, and hedge funds (All throughout the Tri-state area) with corresponding contacts with someone in the firm, email addresses, phone numbers, and an application date (if they had one).

I couldn't even count the number of rejections

Fast forward, and I'm back at school for the beginning of my senior year and last football season. While in training camp I had devised this plan that I was going to individually email every firm on my list, send individual emails to every one of my contacts, and send handwritten letters and resumes to every Bulge Bracket Bank and large AM firm that I could. I did just that. Weeks and weeks and weeks go by with rejection after rejection. I couldn't even count the number of rejections I had received. I would sometimes receive a rejection email within seconds of hitting the "Submit my Application" button. I had recruiters ghosting me, and everyone in the world looking at me telling me it was impossible. It was impossible in everyone else's eyes because every other candidate that I was going up against was from an IVY league school with a top percentage GPA. It actually got to the point where I believed them.

S&T Interview...

Until one day... I receive an email from a Bulge Bracket Bank that wants to do a first round phone interview for a FTS&T position. I did the phone interview (while in my car on the way home from practice) and we had a great conversation about football and work ethic and what it takes to be successful in the industry. I received an email inviting me to NYC for a final round Super day. I was pumped! With just the luck I have... I end up getting the flu the day before the Superday. I sucked it up, chugged a few packets of Vitamin C, and was off to my interview.

I was on cloud nine

I had to part take in a 5 round interview and also give a 45 min presentation on specific investment examples (after being given 20 mins to read through the material) with a 101 fever. I absolutely killed the interviews despite my cough and teeth chattering fever. Two weeks later I get a phone call while I'm in class and I quickly run out of the classroom to answer. It was the bank offering me a FT job in their S&T analyst program. I was on cloud nine. I think the whole business building had heard me scream in excitement. I start training this upcoming July!

Anything to separate yourself from the crowd

So again, I apologize for the long post and probably not the best grammar, but I wanted to share my story because I can first hand understand how extremely stressful it can be. People will be telling you "Its Impossible" or "You can never do it" for the entirety of your life. It takes determination and consistency to separate yourself from the crowd. Any job or position you hold, you have to make the most out of your experience. It's too easy to just sit there and complain about how you hate your job and you wish you were doing something else. Actually do something that is going to help you down the road! Learn something! Teach yourself something new! Think of a new investment pitch! Anything to separate yourself from the crowd. Every finance major at any school no matter where you are has the notion that they are going to end up with this amazing job on the street. Its determination, hard work, and perseverance that really separates the men from the boys.

Thanks for reading and I wish all of you monkeys the best in your careers.

If you have any questions please feel free to ask!

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No BB FT Offer to Buyside Research Associate

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Hi everyone.

I just wanted to thank you all for the help I've received by looking on this board for the past few years. I originally thought I was set for a career in S&T, but when I received no FT offer after this summer I was really discouraged and thought the situation was hopeless. Nevertheless I networked as much as possible and was able to go through several intense rounds at a major buy side shop to become a Research Associate there.

It's really my dream job and I am in debt to everyone here who has posted along the way. If anyone has any interest about entry-level in AM/mutual funds or making the jump straight from undergrad and the interview process, please don't hesitate to send a PM.

Thanks again guys!

How I landed my dream job:

OCR

So number one the firm recruited at my school, so this obviously helped. I know that the big fund families only recently started pulling new hires out of undergrad, so this won't apply for everyone. I am at a semi-target with an excellent alumni network.

Networking and Interviews

At the info session I networked heavily for the group I wanted to go into and really showed my interest and knowledge in the area to the senior analyst who was there. I played the game, sent the thank yous, all of that. I was lucky enough to receive a first-round interview, and would you know it, the same guy I spoke to was the interviewer. He absolutely grilled me on my internship experience and a 30 min discussion about a specific industry (think financials/autos) including what drives it, what the recent news has been, and what my outlook was for the firms in the industry. The entire time I focused on how I had to really hustle and network to get where I am, and he really appreciated that. I also showed my passion for investing by talking about my PA, my views on the market, and being really energetic.

"I would kill for this job"

I was invited in for the final round in the company office and was told that I would have 5 interviews followed by a 45 minute presentation on a stock they would give me one week beforehand. All of the interviews were with analysts and had a few stock pitches, some market questions, a lot about my story/fit, and then a lot of industry analysis. Again, I focused on my energy and on my passion for investing. I didn't get all of the questions right, but I emphasized that I would kill for this job and it showed.

My stock pitch presentation

For the pitch I could use anything to research and support my thesis. I've never worked as hard on anything in my life and created a 4 page report and a PowerPoint on my company. I did several valuation methods, read through all of the conference calls on earnings, and visited a few stores. Ultimately they weren't looking for a perfect analysis, but they wanted to see that I knew my stuff and put a lot of work in. I gave my presentation to all of my interviewers (including the head of research) and just talked about what I knew. I felt awesome about it and then got the call about 10 days later and immediately accepted. If anyone has any other questions about my process or anything I can help with then don't hesitate.

2017 Update:

6ish years later and am now at a HF. Just wanted to give a shout out to the new HF guide and say that I highly recommend it if you are looking to prep for interviews as well as have a firm understanding of the industry. Check it out here: WSO Hedge Fund Prep Pack

Mod Note (Andy) Throwback Thursday - this was originally posted Nov 2011

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Graduating Today

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success story

Graduating today Summa Cum Laude with a 3.85 cum GPA from possibly one of the most overvalued non-targets in the country.

OCR& my overpriced non-target university:

Tuition runs about 40K a year, and this year there was no finance career fair. Last year Fidelity was the only decent firm at the finance/accounting career fair and they recruit for client service reps. Best firms that recruited here were Eaton Vance, Putnam Investments and Fidelity and they were all for mutual fund service rep/client service rep.

Career services was the biggest joke on the planet (does barely anything beneficial for finance students). I didn't even know about internships until January of my junior year. The non-target I am graduating from is worth 15K max. It is a private, catholic, liberal arts college.

A little bit of luck...

I got lucky that I met one kid who had his mind set on IB since his freshman year and he was nice enough to "Show me the water." He could visually see I was thirsty as we are probably the two most driven kids at our school (he is a junior with current 3.98 cum GPA). Then I got even more lucky when over the summer I discovered WSO. Don't know where I would be without the two and wanted to give a shout out and thank WSO.

Interview preparation:

I came across the Wall Street Oasis interview guide and it was definitely instrumental in my success. By practicing these questions, I was well prepared going into my interview and was able to land the gig I had been hoping for. My passion for the markets made it clear to me I wanted to do sales & trading. I would highly recommend using this guide to practice if you are going to be interviewing on the street:

http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/investment-ba...

Stay hungry non-targets and eat your soup with a fork!

So all of this and I got extremely lucky to land a SA sales and trading gig at a boutique that will turn into full-time once I prove my worth. I think I am literally the first student from my non-target that has ever gone straight from undergrad to an IBank. I worked very hard for my GPA and through the recruiting process. Again, I wanted to thank WSO for help keeping me informed on high finance. Just stay hungry non-targets and eat your soup with a fork! I strongly believe that with faith, persistence, motivation and dedication anything can be accomplished. =)

May 2018 update

I stayed in equities S&T for a little over a yr before I moved. Currently corporate treasury analyst at a big international bank.

Mod Note (Andy) - Throwback Thursday - this was originally posted May 2014

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Where Would You Be Without WSO?

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wallstreetoasis

I've had this thought pondering in my head for quite some time. If it was never for my finance professor making our class do research on investment banking, I would have never stumbled upon WSO my sophomore year. I probably would not be anywhere near where I am today. I've had a lot of help from the advice given on these forums, and I can say with certainty that I could not have done it if it weren't for WSO.

Where would you be if this forum never existed?

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Got into a target because of you guys! 2.6 GPA in high school!

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target school

I'm sure so many of you are tired of seeing my name around here - but god damn this community is truly amazing.

  1. I graduated from a shitty high-school (Ranked 2/10 on Zillow).
  2. I had a 2.6 GPA
  3. I smoked weed (perfectly fine, but is just not for me) and was distracted, didn't care about my future
  4. I went to community college doing computer science, with plans to transfer to an unranked state school
  5. I found WSO
  6. I spent literally day in and day out learning about finance and tuning into the WSO podcasts, this is what I would consider the catalyst that made me realize my future and what I wanted to truly do
  7. I paid an absurd amount of money to study in London the summer between my freshman and sophomore year in college
  8. I came back, and leveraged that experience to network my way into being the only sophomore coming from community collegeat a top F500 for their Corp Finance/Strategy Summer Internship for juniors
  9. I started a finance club, and helped over 30 students at my CC hone in on their futures. This was hard, most students at my CC don't care or work hard enough to be involved in something like this
  10. I continued to network, close my mouth, open my eyes and ears, and focus on improving myself - both academically, mentally, and physically
  11. I started early at the F500 in their Business Development team responsible for M&A (Corp Dev is what the group SHOULD be called, team is very small and ex bankers/ivy league'rs) because I aggressively pushed the director of the program with this fact: because i'm in CC i'm the only one local, and that means I can help before summer starts as I was aware they were lean
  12. Now, i'm leading my group/team of interns out of an intern class of ~30. I'm recruiting for IB SA2019 now, since I've got a fucking credible name behind me on my resume

Throughout all of this I have dealt with so much bullshit and family politics, drama, loss of social life (was extremely popular in high school - stopped seeing everyone the second I honed in on my self)

Now, I'm going to a T25 target school, and although i'm coming in as a Junior, you bet i'm gonna secure that SA gig at ANY investment bank that will recognize my desire to be a part of this community. I'll even delay grad by a year if I have to, since it's late into recruiting season right now.

That's all. Thank you all for teaching me everything I needed to know, to achieve some of the most important moments in my life so far. I look forward to paying it forward for the rest of my life. The lesson to be learned here is no matter how low your position might seem, you can always do something to inch your way up. This was a process over the course of two years, and I've still got a far way to go before I can say I've made it.

P.S. I applied to ten schools, ranking all the way from top 20 to >100 on US News. I was accepted by all of the top schools; and denied by the worst ones. I had a 3.5 college GPA. It's not impossible if you don't have a 4.0 - we all have our reasons, mine was weighed down by two D's I got in HS while dual enrolled at CC. College admissions is a wooly mammoth shit show and there are so many variables that go into your decision that you can never be sure where you're gonna get in - unless you're a perfect applicant :~)

-cp

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to Saturday, June 16, 2018 - 4:55pm
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I made it. So can you. Thanks WSO!

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made it

Posts like these are a dime a dozen, but I need to tell my story so that the next kid can take inspiration if they ever stumble onto this post. This is a long post, but I promise it's worth it.

Background

Was born and raised in Australia to immigrant, lower-class parents. We left when I was about 12 years old to a shithole country for dad's work. I grew up believing I wanted to become a doctor, immersing myself in pre-med subjects like Biology and Chemistry. I never particularly enjoyed any of that, but had my heart set on becoming a physician. I attended university in said country for a year, enrolling in a pre-med degree but utterly hated it. Wasn't doing so well and figured "screw this", and decided to reevaluate my options.

Biggest change came about when the family moved back to Australia, which I initially believed was my second chance to pursue medicine (thanks to the undergraduate MBBS system we have here). I took all the tests and ended up falling short of being admitted into med school.

My life spiraled out of control. I slipped into depression and didn't know what to do anymore. I initially considered re-starting my pre-med degree at a brand name university we have here but the mere thought of studying pre-med made me miserable. Thankfully, had a cousin who was sympathetic with my situation, and began advising me as to what to study.

He took me down to the city, where for the first time in such a long time, I was walking between skyscrapers. I hadn't seen a proper city setting since leaving Australia as a child, and just being there was incredible to me. Cousin then takes me out for lunch, and tells me:

"This could all be yours if you want it bad enough"

Those words got me. As a kid that grew up in a not-so-ideal setting, the thought of me being a part of all this was nothing short of miraculous. In a desperate plea, I asked him to tell me what I should pursue at university. He told me finance/economics was the way to go, since he knew I was pretty good with math.

He then proceeded to tell me about IB, and what the job entails. Went home and stayed up all night researching what investment banking was and how to break in. The money got to me (obviously). The prestige was all there. I now had a second chance to prove to myself that I could make something of myself. That I could buy the nicer things in life, like I had seen in the movies. This was my only shot.

Immediately enrolled at the best university in the country to study finance and economics. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. Pre-med was the only thing I ever knew, and I had never taken any economics or business studies in school, so naturally I was very intimidated, but determined.

I found finance fascinating. Didn't even know what a stock vs bond was. But who cares, I began reading and developing a genuine passion for learning finance and economics. I loved it all, which is what makes the next part so puzzling to me even till now...

Setback

Baptism by fire. That's what I use to describe my first year at university. Failed 3 subjects. So much for being determined, aye? No excuses, I fucked up pretty bad. I let the chip on my shoulder - the fact that I was restarting university after almost 2 years - get the better of me.

This was the lowest I had ever felt in my life, and lemme tell you, it isn't pretty. Never before had I questioned myself and my abilities to pursue a respectful career. I felt so stupid, since I had given up so much to be here and I was doing so bad. At this point, I considered dropping out of university all together. Clearly wasn't cut out for this shit, I told myself, crying myself to sleep.

In my depressed haze, I was browsing Google when I stumbled across WSO. Thank God I found WSO. Where would I be without this forum, I constantly ask myself. Began religiously reading every post I could find. Began learning the importance of networking, work experience, the need to be competitive both academically and outside of university.

I had found my last lifeline. This would be it. My very last chance. And I'd be fucked before I fell short again.

Baby Steps

Spent most of that summer applying for internships at small boutiques. Sent probably 250 emails until I got a shot at a small VC fund. It was unpaid, one day a week and involved a lot of cold calling, but I was so thrilled to get that opportunity. Spent around 5 months there, soaking up everything I could, and loving every second of it. I was doing a good job, receiving great feedback from the associate I worked under. Hell, they even started telling me I was welcome to join as a graduate when I finished my studies. I also began picking myself up academically, hitting a 3.0 GPA for that semester. Things were starting to improve.

I was still set on IB, and figured this place would give me some great experience to put on my CV and could be a good place to kickstart my career from.

Unexpected Events

Got a call from work one day, saying they no longer required my services since the partners at the fund had a falling out and the fund was in the process of unwinding. I was devastated. However, I knew I had step things up and networking with other boutiques. I wanted IB more than anything, so leveraging what I already had, I began the hunt again.

As sheer luck would have it, I networked with a director at a boutique advisory firm who happened to be an advisor at the fund I interned at. He was happy to take me on board as an intern and help him out. It was glorified data entry work, compiling investor lists and spreadsheets. But I was happy. I was getting more experience.

In the meanwhile, I became good friends with a director at a well established PE firm. Nicest guy ever, and gave me regular suggestions. Told me to apply to the Big 4 in their CF division for an internship. I remember laughing:

"My GPA is so shit they'd bin my CV before even meeting me."

He insisted I give it a shot, telling me I'd be pleasantly surprised if I tried. Figured meh, may as well waste some time and apply. Still to my shock today, I got in. Turns out he made a few calls and made sure I got the opportunity. Impressed the hell out of them, securing a graduate offer. Couldn't believe it. Still don't believe it.

The power of networking, boys and girls. Never underestimate it.

I made It

Academically, past two years I really pulled my socks up. Wasn't gonna rest on my laurels and half-ass my way through the remainder of my degree. I'm proud to say I didn't get under a 3.7 for my remaining semesters. I'll be graduating with a 3.0, which I know isn't by any means impressive, but considering I had a 1.8 in my first year, I'm rather proud of myself for recovering so quickly.

As I finish my last week of university, I have secured another graduate offer with a well-regarded boutique. I will be choosing them over the Big 4 CF. The deal exposure I'll be given is incredible, and financially speaking is much better than the CF offer.

Key Takeaways

Looking back, from my very shaky start to now, I feel I can give some key points to summarize:

  1. Don't ever give up. Sounds cliched but trust me, things can get pretty tough. You were born to succeed.
  2. WSO is a godsend. Exhaust it as much as humanly possible.
  3. Network, network and network some more. This was by far the great 'equalizer' for me and many others.
  4. Never forget how bad you want to make it. Set your goals and annihilate them.
  5. Some of us came from nothing, and that's OK. Work twice as hard.

Thanks to all that read the entire post, and apologies if it isn't coherent. I just hope that one day someone that was in my situation stumbles upon this post and takes inspiration.

And here's a special thanks to all those that contribute on WSO. You the real MVPs.

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Chip On Your Shoulder

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Grew up on the wrong side of town. Didn't go to a prestigious institution. Didn't get an offer from your ideal firm or industry. Lehman 2008 SA Class. Whatever it is, there are life experiences that give people chips on their shoulders.

Yesterday I was having a conversation with a good friend and coworker about this topic, and specifically how when someone has a chip on their shoulder, it drives them to do very well. This is antidotal but makes sense: when someone is unhappy with their situation and is able and willing to change it, they do. In your life an experience, how have you seen this play out?

Additionally, while angst can be used to drive, it can lead to blindness and other hindrances. Glucksman went for the throne at Lehman because he felt the traders were not getting their deserved recognition and ended up bringing down the firm. Kravis grossly overpaid for RJR so someone else would not make headlines for performing the largest LBO in history. Jeff Skilling wanted to be extremely rich, so he created a company that became a leader in its industry, and now Enron is synonymous with corporate fraud and greed.

I assume there are a decent amount of readers here, and people in finance, that have a chip on their shoulder, no matter how small or if they recognize it. I know I do, and acknowledging it allows me to try to channel it to drive me and use it productively. I am wondering if there was a way I could do so more effectively. Any thoughts, advice, or stories?

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Is is too late for SA 2019?

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I have been reading posts about students already securing positions at BB. Is it too late to secure a position now or was this just the accelerated round and the regular is yet to start?

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The WSO Scholarship Has Been Awarded!

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Earlier this week we selected the first ever recipient of the WSO Scholarship. The winner is Regan McCall of Princeton University. She was chosen based on the quality of both her essay and the video she submitted.

THANK YOU to all that applied; we will make announcement when we open up applications for the next WSO Scholarship.

The Wall Street Oasis Scholarship


The primary goal of Wall Street Oasis is to help educate young finance professionals and students as they approach critical career decisions. It is a place where finance professionals can come to learn more about other related fields, network with other members, and even apply to specific jobs that interest them.

Since our main objective is to help in the education of our members, we have created an annual scholarship for one undergraduate student. We hope to assist with your educational goals.

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Thank You (BB SA Offer)

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As a long-time lurker (4+ years) and an avid reader of the forum, I just wanted to say thank you to everyone on the forum for the advice, experiences, and tips shared throughout the site; it has truly been invaluable to landing an offer for Summer 2019.

Although I have never posted on the forum, I feel as though I have received a free lunch of sorts from members who do, in fact, post routinely. As such, if anyone would like to discuss the process - either within this discussion or through a PM - I would be more than happy to help out.

A couple questions:

  • Being a year out, are there any pressing items I should be taking care of before the start of the internship?
  • Having already received my group placement, should I be reaching out to more senior members of the group first or, rather, start with analysts and work my way up?

Once again, thank you so much to everyone on the forum for your help and please feel free to reach out through a PM - especially if you have an idea of the firm and have any advice (I'd be happy to disclose the bank/group there too).

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